*pls help pick northern calif local mover: metropolitan, moovers, canova?

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christine
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2005 7:54 pm
Location: northern california

*pls help pick northern calif local mover: metropolitan, moovers, canova?

Postby christine » Sun Aug 03, 2008 3:37 am

Everyone was so helpful when we moved 3 years ago, I've come back hoping for more guidance. Could you please help us select a company for our move from Napa to Davis (50 miles, though don't know how many "constructive miles"). We have 3 estimates for a move on August 25:

METROPOLITAN VAN & STORAGE (Atlast agent in Benicia, www.metrovan.com)
Rep: Naomi Banda
DOT: 222569 (MC 138536)
PUC: T95137
BBB: 0 complaints past 3 yrs
Free Boxes?: Yes, currently lots in warehouse
Estimated Wt: 8,687 lb (1,241 cu. ft.)
Hourly Charge (4 men): ($175 x 9hrs = $1,575) + ($215 x 1hr overtime = $215) (4hr load, 2hr drive, 4hr unload) => $1,790
Min # Hours: 8hrs (including drive time)
Packing: $376.70 (incl tax, 10% discount) ($273.28 if no mattress/mirrors pack)
8- dishpack @ $9.72/box, $23.58/pack => $266.40
3- 3.0carton @ $2.93/box, $7.36/pack => $30.87
3- mirror @ $9.66/box, $8.63/pack => $54.87
2- mattress @ $21.34/box, $6.04/pack => $54.76
7- free wardrobe
Fuel Charge: flat rate $150
Valuation: Full Value Replace $39,100, (0 Deductible): $371.45
TOTAL NOT TO EXCEED: $2,688.15 => $2,584.73 if no mattress/mirrors pack

MOOVERS, INC. (Benicia & Concord www.mooversinc.com)
Rep: Jayson Berger
DOT: 1176313 (MC474184)
PUC: T 190167
BBB: Member, 1 complaint past 3 yrs including 1 in past yr (refund, resolved)
Free Boxes?: Yes, but minimal available at warehouse
Estimated Wt: 8,000lb
Hourly Charge (3 men): $130/hr x 9.5 hr (4hr load, 2hr drive, 3.5hr unload) = $1,235
Min # Hours: ??
Packing: 4 dishpack @ $32.60/box&pack => $130.40
-reuse mattress, mirror boxes
-10 free wardrobe
Fuel Charge: None
Valuation: Full Value Replace $40,000 (0 Deductible) = $400
TOTAL NOT TO EXCEED: $1,765.40

CANOVA MOVING & STORAGE (Atlas Agent in Fairfield, www.canovamoving.com)
Rep: Pam Dennis (she/husband are part owners)
DOT: MC 126582
PUC: T-132708
BBB: Member, 1 complaint past 3yrs, 0 past yr (delivery, resolved)
Free Boxes?: No, but $100 credit toward purchasing their new or used boxes
Estimated Wt: 9,114 lb (1,302 cu. ft.)
Hourly Charge (3men): $145 x 11hrs (4.5hr drive, 2.5hr drive, 4hr unload) => $1,595
Min # Hours: 6 hrs
Packing: 5 dishpack ($6.50/box=$32.50), include packing => $70
-reuse mattress, mirror boxes
-10 free wardrobe
Fuel Charge: none
Valuation: Full Value Replace (0 Deductible): $585
TOTAL NOT TO EXCEED: $1,665 => $2,250 if $585 valuation added


We called Moovers because of the rave reviews here and Metropolitan and Canova because they're Atlas companies (we had 2 great moves w/ Atlas). As the reps calculated their estimates, I made available to them the estimate and shipper order/freight bill from our last move, which we referenced to figure out what kind of packing and valuation we required on our last move.

Initial Impressions
Jayson at Moovers had difficulty making our appointment on time since he apparently has a new guy answering phones who set an impossible schedule for him, traveling all around the Bay Area in short time frames. Jayson did call that morning to try to reschedule and eventually made it that day, but I was a bit concerned he didn't immediately have his appointments cancelled or rescheduled as soon as he saw it'd be tight fitting them in. As it was, he said he didn't make it to one of that day's appts since it was impossible to make it. Of course, my expectations were probably highest for him due to the tremendous reviews here, so I might be judging too harsh.

Except for that minimal glitch, all 3 representatives left very good impressions. They were all courteous, not pushy, personable and answered all my questions. They all were thorough in checking out every room, cupboard, etc as they did their "table of measurements" inventory (Metropolitan's was w/ handheld computer device, Moovers & Canova used trad'l paper forms). Each left me with written, signed esimates and the required PUC moving booklet.

Weight Estimates
Canova's 9,114lb & Moover's 8,000lb are within 10% of Metropolitan's 8,687lb estimate. Our last move was 6,520lb, but we've since gotten a TV (heavy CRT not flatscreen), futon/mattress, 2 tables, big grill, lawnmower and other smaller/lighter items. None seemed to miss any major items in the house.

Hourly Charges
All 3 had similar estimates on the # hours needed for loading, unloading and driving. Metropolitan charged the most per hour, including an overtime rate the others didn't have. Although their estimate was for 4 men, which I'd think would make the move faster, that potential savings might be offset by their 8hr minimum (plus more guys to tip at the end :) ). In fact, the estimate using 4 men was about the same # hours for loading/unloading as the other estimates using 3 men.

Jayson did not mention a minimum # hours, but I need to confirm that with him. Canova has a 6 hr minimum.

Packing
We requested a partial pack of breakable kitchen items. The Metropolitan estimate included packing for mattress/mirrors since she was the first to come and I hadn't realized til later that I'd saved those boxes from our last move. I subtracted that charge in the total price to make the comparison fair.

Jayson at Moovers gave lots of great tips for packing/moving while we walked around the house, in fact all 3 gave good tips. He also said they use shrink-wrap then blankets for the dressers; the others use just blankets.

For packing, Metropolitan estimated we needed 8 dishpacks and 3- 3.0 cartons, Moovers estimated 4 dishpacks, Canova estimated 5 dishpacks. I think the Metropolitan estimate is way high since our last movers used only 3 dishpacks and 1- 3.5 carton (we haven't acquired any breakables since then).

The Canova packing estimate seems really low at $70 for both packing and 5 dishpacks. Since the cartons are $6.50 each, that means they charge only $7.50 to pack. Pam confirmed the charge included packing and boxes and noted it on the estimate after I questioned her. I notice now though that while the estimate says $70 "packing charge includes boxes for items we pack," the top of the form shows that packing labor is charged hourly, rather than by unit. I will call Pam to clarify this.

Valuation
I requested full value replacement coverage with zero deductible because that's what I did last time and I assumed I did so based on advice here on movingscam.

Pam at Canova suggested I save money and get actual cash value coverage, which she said their customers usually get. In fact, their handout with valuation options and list of charges for boxes lists only the free $.60/lb coverage or actual cash value, no mention of full replacement value (though it's an option on the estimate form).

She said if anything was damaged, they'd pay the claim (other owner John Canova oversees claims and ensures any problems are handled to customer's satisfaction). She also said to check our homeowner's insurance to see if it would cover us should the truck burn down or something like that. But she said they'd of course offer full value replacement coverage if I wanted it, and verbally quoted me $585 for full value replacment w/ zero deductible (highest charge of all 3 companies, but I think it's based on estimated weight?), $202.50 w/$250 deductible ($84.70 for actual cash value). She also siad they don't do the household inventory on the move unless we pay for full value. I've included the $585 in my total estimate above.

I'm pretty sure we want full value coverage. Is it odd that a company would push cash value coverage instead?

Complaints & Business/Safety Records
Still need to call PUC & CMSA (all 3 are members) to see if they have complaints for these companies.

So far, Metropolitan seems to have the best complaint record, with nothing on BBB past 3 years and nothing (good or bad) on movingscam by folks who've actually used them. Calif Sec'y State site indicates there was a prior license they used (C08182840) that was suspended, though I found nothing else on that. The current license (C0573417) is active. SaferSys says they have 9 power units, 10 drivers. They show great inspection records of 2.7% vehicle out of service (23.14% is avg), 0% driver out of service (6.8% is avg), zero crashes past 24 mo. They have minimal insurance required. Says no safety rating though, which I don't understand.

Moovers has almost all raves here. Jayson and I talked about movingscam.com and what a great site it is and how companies really should strive to do well by their customers, etc. Secretary of State shows dba Matthews Contract Services, lists Concord address, but attorneys in Los Angeles are their agent for service. But Jayson's business card, the website and the estimate don't list any address. In fact, the Moovers estimate does not even have the company name on it (whenever I've seen these forms, they've had the company name, address, DOT#s, etc preprinted). SaferSys says they have 18 power units, 15 drivers. Inspection record shows 19.6% vehicles out of service, 7% drivers out of service, zero crashes past 24mo. They have minimal insurance required. Safety rating says "non-ratable" safety rating, which I don't understand.

Canova is not reviewed on movingscam, but there's an inquiry from "dyjh" in 2006 asking if anyone had items missing from delivery. This sounds like it would be the same move as the delivery complaint BBB reports as resolved. If it is, Pam told me (w/out my asking) they are very proud of their customer service record. She said the BBB has 1 complaint, which is the only complaint she knows of in her 25yrs there. She said it involved an elderly woman w/ Alzheimer's who complained to the BBB that items were missing from her delivery. She said it was too bad because the complaint was made to BBB without calling Canova first and they would've done everything to make things right, and that the woman's son later confirmed they had received all their goods in the move. Pam also gave me copies of thank you letters, etc from past customers. She stressed that she and her husband strive to make sure every customer is satisfied, etc, and I felt she was being forthright.

Secretary of State site says company was previosuly John J Canova dba Canova Moving. SaferSys says Canova has 16 power units, 10 drivers. Inspection shows 22.22% vehicles out of service, 2.8% drivers out of service, zero crashes past 24 mo. They have $1million insurance though $300k required, and a "satisfactory" safety record.

Who to Choose?
Although I think they'd be fine to use, I'm eliminating Metropolitan because their charges are high. They have the highest hourly rates, estimated high on packing and loading/unloading, had a fuel charge (understandable these days but the only one to do so), and had high minimum #hrs.

I am leaning slightly toward Canova even they charge more than Moovers. I liked working directly with one of the company owners and believe the company really tries to take care of their customers. I also liked that their business and safety records looked clean. But I do have questions about their packing estimate and valuation coverage, as described above.

Reading more Moovers reviews here, it appears Jayson is also a part-owner? He never told me that -- his business card says Account Executive. The company SaferSys record seemed ok, but not great. I'm also uncomfortable working with a company that does not include an address on its website, business cards or estimate. I realize from the reviews here this is not a scammer company, but it's a bit unsettling. Otherwise, I thought Jayson was great and I too felt like he would ensure everything would go well with the move.

I think I'm getting nitpicky because they are probably all good companies. Any feedback on these companies and my selection process is appreciated. Thanks for reading this ridiculously long post and for your help!

BigLeeCalif
Posts: 4655
Joined: Sat Aug 23, 2003 5:59 pm
Location: Escondido, California

Re: pls help pick northern calif local mover: metropolitan, moovers, canov

Postby BigLeeCalif » Sun Aug 03, 2008 11:13 am

Overall, I think your best bet is Moovers.

Metropolitan is charging you $150 flat fee for fuel, whereas Moovers and Canova arent. I also notice that they claim the same time to unload as they do to load. Normally it takes less time to unload than load... the exception being if you are going from ground floor to place with a flight or stairs or elevator.

As for boxes, ask the movers if you purchase new, will they credit you for the return of unused, and used. When I worked at Caton/Chipman, we would credit full for unused cartons, and half for used cartons. This time of year during the busy season, sometimes there is a shortage of used material.

California has a maximum rate tariff, so if a company is giving you an estimate, and have given you not-to-exceed figure, there is no requirement that they show a minimum number of hours, if your job is estimated to be over 8 hrs.

I would also ask Metropolitan why, in addition to a fuel surcharge, they are charging $215 for overtime.

Most movers I know in the Bay area don't charge overtime unless the job has to start before 8 or after 5pm. A job already in progress usually is billed at straight time.

Also it is not unusual for company owners not to list them on business cards as owners. Our owner shows his name and contact info and President, not owner.

I wouldn't disqualify Moovers solely because Jayson didn't mention he was an owner. I have recommended several people use their services, and not a single one has been dissatisfied. One of the reasons Jayson may have a busy schedule is that they are expanding rapidly, and it is getting more difficult to keep the hands on approach to local surveys.
Their key to success is that they have that type of service for local and intra moves, and I know they do stand behind their service.

As for forms, they may use a generic form for California jobs. The only concern you need to ask them about is what information will be on the form they present to you for your move. It should list their name and physical address, and their Cal T number. If you have a written estimate, it should show the estimate amount, and the not-to-exceed amount. It should also show the charges for valuation, and your options. Those are required by the California PUC. If you wish to PM me on Monday, I can scan and email you what a California bill of lading looks like.

There is nothing wrong with Metropolitan or Canova. They are well qualified movers in the Bay Area.

One thing to ask your movers is whether they use hourly crews, or local contractors. Contractors tend to be more efficient, because they get a percentage of the total job, not the hourly rate, and if there are damage claims, they get charged back. Their incentive is to be quick and damage free.
Last edited by BigLeeCalif on Sun Aug 03, 2008 11:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
"It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt" Mark Twain

rydog444
Posts: 1022
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2007 11:44 pm

Re: pls help pick northern calif local mover: metropolitan, moovers, canov

Postby rydog444 » Sun Aug 03, 2008 11:26 am

I don't think you need anybody's help here at this point. You have done a tremendous job of selecting, evaluating, and compairing your movers. I think you are going to get a good move any way you go, it is just up to you at this point to decide who you are most comfortable with. It is more of a personal comfort, as 2 people may select different companies from your list and both make the correct decision for them.

Congratulations on such an excellent job done and keep us posted on your decision and how everything goes.
My job is to give the best domestic and international moving services to my corporate clients by using the best movers in the world, regardless of vanline affiliation.

bigmove
Posts: 438
Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2007 6:56 am
Location: California

Re: pls help pick northern calif local mover: metropolitan, moovers, canov

Postby bigmove » Sun Aug 03, 2008 12:02 pm

I agree with Rydog. You did your homework, and go with who you are most comfortable with.

christine
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2005 7:54 pm
Location: northern california

Re: pls help pick northern calif local mover: metropolitan, moovers, canov

Postby christine » Sun Aug 03, 2008 4:42 pm

Thank you everyone for your help and encouragement! Can't believe anyone read my long post! :o

BigLeeCalif wrote:Metropolitan is charging you $150 flat fee for fuel, whereas Moovers and Canova arent. I also notice that they claim the same time to unload as they do to load. Normally it takes less time to unload than load... the exception being if you are going from ground floor to place with a flight or stairs or elevator.

Yeah, I noticed Moovers and Canova estimate slightly less for unload. We are going from 1-story house to 2-story house (bedrooms/bathroom upstairs). I told them the new place is 2-story, but none checked off "Flights at Destination" or charged for it. Pam at Canova said they only charge if it's stairs going to the new place -- like a 2nd story apartment -- not internal stairs to a second-story in a single family home. She checked off "SNR" service not requested on Flights at Destination" column, and handwrote "Inside" there.

BigLeeCalif wrote:I wouldn't disqualify Moovers solely because Jayson didn't mention he was an owner. I have recommended several people use their services, and not a single one has been dissatisfied. One of the reasons Jayson may have a busy schedule is that they are expanding rapidly, and it is getting more difficult to keep the hands on approach to local surveys. Their key to success is that they have that type of service for local and intra moves, and I know they do stand behind their service.

As for forms, they may use a generic form for California jobs. The only concern you need to ask them about is what information will be on the form they present to you for your move. It should list their name and physical address, and their Cal T number. If you have a written estimate, it should show the estimate amount, and the not-to-exceed amount. It should also show the charges for valuation, and your options. Those are required by the California PUC. If you wish to PM me on Monday, I can scan and email you what a California bill of lading looks like.


Yeah, not nixing Moovers because Jayson didn't say he was an owner, just noted he didn't mention it. I was more concerned they didn't have their address anywhere -- website, biz card, estimate form. They did use the standard "Basis for Carrier's Estiamted Cost of Services" form, same as Canova and as I've gotten on our prior move, just thought it weird they didn't have their name written anywhere -- printed or handwritten. I also wondered if they're growing too fast and trying to do too much. That's why I worried the issue w/ overbooking the in-home estimate schedule might get repeated when it came time to booking the actual move.

I have a "Combined Agreement for Moving Services and Freight Bill" that we got from our last move. Is that the same as the Bill of Lading? If so, I see where it has "Estimated Cost of Services" and "Not to Exceed Price." On the estimates I got this week, Jayson hand-wrote "Not to Exceed" next to total estimated cost, and Metropolitan's computer printed estimate also says "Total Not to Exceed Cost." Pam of Canova did not hand-write "Not to Exceed" on the estimate, but if we go with them I'll make sure it says not to exceed on the Combined Agreement/Freight Bill. I'll also make sure whoever we use has the name, address, PUC # etc on that form. Thanks.

BigLeeCalif wrote:As for boxes, ask the movers if you purchase new, will they credit you for the return of unused, and used. When I worked at Caton/Chipman, we would credit full for unused cartons, and half for used cartons. This time of year during the busy season, sometimes there is a shortage of used material.


Good idea. I know we can buy new or used from Canova. Hadn't thought of asking if they bought them back. Would have to be a good price though since it's about 45 min drive from new place to warehouses and gas=$.

BigLeeCalif wrote:One thing to ask your movers is whether they use hourly crews, or local contractors. Contractors tend to be more efficient, because they get a percentage of the total job, not the hourly rate, and if there are damage claims, they get charged back. Their incentive is to be quick and damage free.


Never heard of that -- thanks, I'll ask. I actually thought it would be better to use a company that uses its own regular crews, sort of an internal company accountability thing. Didn't realize the contractors got charged back for damage.

BigLeeCalif wrote:California has a maximum rate tariff, so if a company is giving you an estimate, and have given you not-to-exceed figure, there is no requirement that they show a minimum number of hours, if your job is estimated to be over 8 hrs.

I would also ask Metropolitan why, in addition to a fuel surcharge, they are charging $215 for overtime.

Most movers I know in the Bay area don't charge overtime unless the job has to start before 8 or after 5pm. A job already in progress usually is billed at straight time.

Ok, so I won't be concerned Moovers didn't have a minimum # hours. Yeah, wondered why Metropolitan charged overtime when others didn't for more and less total hours. I didn't request specific start/end times, but mentioned there's heavy traffic on our route during rush hour after 3pm. They all said they expected to be on the road before rush hour. Naomi at Metropolitan said they start earlier than most other companies, by 8:30, so it wouldn't be a problem w/ traffic. (I don't know if any of the companies factored in how much traffic there would be getting in to Napa during morning rush hour from their warehouse -- I'll give them a head's up when we pick a mover).

BigLeeCalif wrote:Overall, I think your best bet is Moovers.

I'm definitely going to eliminate Metropolitan now. Why do you think Moovers is best? Because of their price and reputation? Or is it my concern that Canova was pushing the actual cash value valuation? I'm still planning to get full value replacement, zero deductible -- does that sound right?

Thank you BigLee for all your help and suggestions. I've always recommended this site to others after I got so much help before, and I'm so glad you all haven't changed (even the same people helping all these years!! :D ).

~christine

christine
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2005 7:54 pm
Location: northern california

Re: pls help pick northern calif local mover: metropolitan, moovers, canov

Postby christine » Sun Aug 03, 2008 4:52 pm

rydog444 wrote:I don't think you need anybody's help here at this point. You have done a tremendous job of selecting, evaluating, and compairing your movers. I think you are going to get a good move any way you go, it is just up to you at this point to decide who you are most comfortable with. It is more of a personal comfort, as 2 people may select different companies from your list and both make the correct decision for them.

Congratulations on such an excellent job done and keep us posted on your decision and how everything goes.


bigmove wrote:I agree with Rydog. You did your homework, and go with who you are most comfortable with.


Aw, thank you both. I learned so much from everyone here, it's such a powerful, and empowering, site. I listed out all my research mainly to get more informed responses, but also to put out the info in case anyone down the road is also researching these companies. The side benefit to my crazy long post was it helped me think through my evaluation by having to type out all the info.

Thank you again for your help!


ps: On my last move, I totally flaked and forgot to come back and post an update and final review (which was stellar). Anyone who's interested please PM me if I haven't posted a review by September. I'm now using a free email address so my account should still be active after the move.

BigLeeCalif
Posts: 4655
Joined: Sat Aug 23, 2003 5:59 pm
Location: Escondido, California

Re: pls help pick northern calif local mover: metropolitan, moovers, canov

Postby BigLeeCalif » Sun Aug 03, 2008 9:46 pm

I'm not taking anything away from Metropolitan, nor do I have any negatives on Canova.

In addition to having satisfied people that I recommended to call Moovers, I have also talked extensively with Jayson on the phone.

We talked about his short-term, and long term visions and goals, and I must say that I was impressed by his willingness to learn new things, and to be receptive to suggestions of East coast operations.

A lot of moving company owners want things to be run their way. I can see that, and respect that position, especially when it's their investment they are trying to protect. No offense to the movers here.

Remember, it's a lot more difficult when you don't have van line affiliations. A good mover recognizes that they have to depend on repeat business, word of mouth, and effective, not always expensive advertising.

I think by not putting their address on the paperwork, Moovers does not have to have separate paperwork printed for each location. I think as time passes, and they see the second location will be successful, their paperwork would probably see reflect that.

Do let us know which way you decide to go, and how it turned out.

If you have any further questions, feel free to ask. We're here to assist.
"It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt" Mark Twain

christine
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2005 7:54 pm
Location: northern california

Re: pls help pick northern calif local mover: metropolitan, moovers, canov

Postby christine » Thu Aug 07, 2008 4:26 am

Thanks BigLee, that was very helpful and assuring. Still undecided but want to pick by this morning. (I'm up late these days dealing w/ all the stresses of escrow. :( )

Some updates from my last posts:

Metropolitan's sales rep (not the estimator) called Tuesday to follow-up on the estimate. I told him hadn't decided yet but leaning toward Moovers and Canova because Metropolitan was so expensive. Told him they were high on hourly charge, # hours considering more men used, minimum #hours, overtime, fuel charge, and estimated # of cartons for packing kitchen breakables. He said he would look over the estimate and see what he could do to lower their price. I was very impressed by all this, but haven't heard back. :(

Jayson at Moovers replied to my email right away and answered some but not all of my many questions. I followed up w/a phone call and got Anthony, who was very helpful. They have a 3hr minimum for moves which we'll easily exceed, no deposit required for local moves, they use their own movers (not contractors), and accept credit cards (but non-local moves have 3% surcharge to use cc). I forgot to confirm if they have workers' comp coverage for their movers, and didn't clarify if they buy back used cartons or credit for unused (they only sell new). They don't overbook moving dates in anticipation of some moves being cancelled/rescheduled.

Pam at Canova replied to my email after I called to follow-up (it got lost in the spam so she didn't see it until I called 2 days later). She answered most but not all of my questions (yes, I ask too many questions). Some of their movers are contractors but they work only for Canova; they have workers' comp for all their movers. The packing was charged for 2 hrs including 5 dishpacks, and is part of the not to exceed price. They don't buy back used cartons; I forgot to ask if they credit unused. She didn't answer whether they overbook their moving dates so I'd need to confirm that.

The way Canova handles valuation concerns me. She said if we go w/ Full Value Protection, they add another $100 to the estimate to account for time spent on the inventory. But, she said they only inventory the furniture items and not the boxes since inventory is done to take note of any existing damage.

Does this sound right? I don't think the others charged extra to do the inventory. And I didn't know they don't inventory boxes. I'll have to ask Moovers if they also inventory furniture only. If they don't, how do we prove the box (and its contents) were damaged by the movers or were already like that?

I'm leaning toward Moovers now because they don't charge extra for inventory, and things just seemed more straightforward with their estimate. And of course they have the lowest estimate overall and their stellar rep here. I'm also more comfortable w/ them using their own movers even though the contractors arguably have more on the line for damaging items.

But I'd appreciate any additional advice before we decide. I don't trust my brain at this hour. :wink:

Diane
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Location: Los Angeles

Re: pls help pick northern calif local mover: metropolitan, moovers, canov

Postby Diane » Thu Aug 07, 2008 5:38 am

Hi, Christine - you have certainly done your homework! I agree with all here that any of the three companies would probably be fine.

Just a note that Moovers does carry workers' comp for all employees. (I know because the principal owner has told me how costly it is.) Also, I believe that Jayson has only a minority interest in the company so I don't really find it strange that he didn't mention that he was a part-owner. It isn't something that a person doing an estimate would normally bring up out of the blue. And, the fact that Moovers doesn't have a street address on its cards is probably related to the fact that it knew that it was going to change offices within the last few years (which did in fact happen) and it didn't want to go to the expense of having new cards made up. In other words, to me, knowing the company and Jayson, nothing about this seems sinister in any way.

You did already post a review of your last move, with Thomas Transfer. Please do post a review of this move too so we can add it to the Superlist.

rydog444
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Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2007 11:44 pm

Re: pls help pick northern calif local mover: metropolitan, moovers, canov

Postby rydog444 » Thu Aug 07, 2008 8:13 am

christine, just a quick note- No matter who you use, if you are paying hourly, you are paying to have your goods inventoried. During the time that it takes to inventory your goods, you are on the clock. The person that told you about that was just trying to be up front about it, because when the estimates were given, they were probably not including the time it takes to inventory your goods. You may want to confirm this with each mover.
My job is to give the best domestic and international moving services to my corporate clients by using the best movers in the world, regardless of vanline affiliation.

BillAdams
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Location: Cos Cob, CT / Oxford, CT

Re: pls help pick northern calif local mover: metropolitan, moovers, canov

Postby BillAdams » Thu Aug 07, 2008 8:41 am

their estimate was for 4 men, which I'd think would make the move faster


For what it's worth,
4 men will do the move in less time than 3.

On an 8000-9000lb weight estimate, I would have written an estimate using 4 men, and I would have estimated 8-9 hours to load and deliver, if the destination is close to origin (add more time if farther).

An extra pair of hands goes a long way towards a making a good day for the movers and the customer.

Good luck.
"Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones that you did do, so throw off the bowlines, sail away from safe harbor, catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore, Dream, Discover."
-Mark Twain

christine
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2005 7:54 pm
Location: northern california

Re: pls help pick northern calif local mover: metropolitan, moovers, canov

Postby christine » Thu Aug 07, 2008 12:38 pm

Diane wrote:Just a note that Moovers does carry workers' comp for all employees. (I know because the principal owner has told me how costly it is.) Also, I believe that Jayson has only a minority interest in the company so I don't really find it strange that he didn't mention that he was a part-owner. It isn't something that a person doing an estimate would normally bring up out of the blue. And, the fact that Moovers doesn't have a street address on its cards is probably related to the fact that it knew that it was going to change offices within the last few years (which did in fact happen) and it didn't want to go to the expense of having new cards made up. In other words, to me, knowing the company and Jayson, nothing about this seems sinister in any way.

You did already post a review of your last move, with Thomas Transfer. Please do post a review of this move too so we can add it to the Superlist.

Thanks for your reassurances, Diane. Jayson responded to my email early this morning and confirmed they are fully licensed & insured, and all employees covered by workers comp.

Yeah, I posted a review of Thomas Transfer, but it was 3yrs late! :oops: Won't do that again, I promise. And thank you so much for the SuperList -- that is such a smart thing to do, but so much for work you guys -- thank you thank you!! :D

christine
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Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2005 7:54 pm
Location: northern california

Re: pls help pick northern calif local mover: metropolitan, moovers, canov

Postby christine » Thu Aug 07, 2008 12:46 pm

rydog444 wrote:christine, just a quick note- No matter who you use, if you are paying hourly, you are paying to have your goods inventoried. During the time that it takes to inventory your goods, you are on the clock. The person that told you about that was just trying to be up front about it, because when the estimates were given, they were probably not including the time it takes to inventory your goods. You may want to confirm this with each mover.

Thanks for the info, I hadn't realized this wasn't included. I asked Moovers and Jayson said inventory isn't required by law on a local move and most time the customer doesn't want to pay for the time to complete one. He said usually as they wrap pieces, they point out any damage to the customer.

So is it worth it to inventory our stuff? I don't know how we could prove damage was caused by the mover unless it was inventoried (and again, don't know how we'd prove it on a box if that's not even part of the usual inventory). Is this where we have to count on the company to have a good claims handling record?

rydog444
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Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2007 11:44 pm

Re: pls help pick northern calif local mover: metropolitan, moovers, canov

Postby rydog444 » Thu Aug 07, 2008 12:58 pm

Jayson is absolutely right. I wouldn't pay to have my goods inventoried. The usual way that claims are handled by legit movers is that if you have a claim, they send an expert out to your home to inspect and access the damage. Items that are newly damaged are generally easy to spot(a new scratch is fresh, old one is not, etc). The decision is yours and yours only, though. If you feel it is worth the cost, have it done.
My job is to give the best domestic and international moving services to my corporate clients by using the best movers in the world, regardless of vanline affiliation.

christine
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2005 7:54 pm
Location: northern california

Re: pls help pick northern calif local mover: metropolitan, moovers, canov

Postby christine » Thu Aug 07, 2008 1:00 pm

BillAdams wrote:
their estimate was for 4 men, which I'd think would make the move faster


For what it's worth,
4 men will do the move in less time than 3.

On an 8000-9000lb weight estimate, I would have written an estimate using 4 men, and I would have estimated 8-9 hours to load and deliver, if the destination is close to origin (add more time if farther).

An extra pair of hands goes a long way towards a making a good day for the movers and the customer.

Good luck.

Thanks, this was very helpful. I think we'll definitely eliminate Metropolitan now, especially since they never got back to me about revising their estimate.


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