ABF: movebuilder.com?

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blue92
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Joined: Wed Feb 10, 2010 12:35 pm

ABF: movebuilder.com?

Postby blue92 » Wed Feb 10, 2010 1:01 pm

I've searched the message boards here and Googled rather extensively, but I'm not finding much information about movebuilder.com. It's a subsidiary of ABF U-Pack -- the purpose is to add on traditional moving services (packing/loading/unloading) to the ABF concept.

BBB lists them as "Moving Solutions Inc."

No complaints that I can find, but not much in the way of recommendations either (at least none that are not obvious advertisements). They've not been operation very long (only about six months according to the BBB listing).

Sounds good in theory that ABF could vet local packing/loading crews as an extension of their trucking fleet, but are these contractors of consistent quality? Or do they not live up to their promises?

Does anyone here have any experience with their service?

Rick
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Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2005 7:59 pm

Re: ABF: movebuilder.com?

Postby Rick » Wed Feb 10, 2010 4:56 pm

Removed
Last edited by Rick on Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Shakybarnes
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Joined: Mon Feb 15, 2010 9:01 pm

Re: ABF: movebuilder.com?

Postby Shakybarnes » Mon Feb 15, 2010 9:19 pm

First -- Do NOT under any circumstance use MoveBuilder! My girlfriend made the mistake of contracting them in January for an interstate move, and we've been dealing with the ramifications ever since.

Being an ABF operation, perhaps it's not a true criminal scam. But might as well be one. Net result so far:

- Nearly all of GF's furniture was damaged to some degree.
- Many items are simply missing
- The estimate provided, based on phone con with MoveBuilder (Arkansas Best Corp), was radically underestimated.
- The movers who arrived were paid by the hour (a fact not clearly represented), and took many hours too long to pack, resulting in an unexpected additional charge.
- Tremendous difficulty in scheduling the drop off
- ABC corp was NO HELP AT ALL, blaming its contractor MovingStaffers, which itself may or may not be an ABC operation, hard to be sure.
- Even after everything was paid, Movebuilder (ABC) made an unauthorized mystery charge of about $1000 to GF's checking account, with the expected disastrous results.
- GF has hired lawyer and looking to sue.

It's proved to be an obscenely incompetent operation. The situation is made murkier because ABF contracted out the operation to another outfit called Movingstaffers.com, which ID's itself as a brand of a company called Albert Container Services. The same contact person uses contact info for both MovingStaffers and MoveBuilder, depending on the situation. Shady stuff, not sure who she really works for.

(As mentioned above, MoveBuilder itself is run by an Arkansas Best Corp. subsidiary called Moving Solutions Inc.)

In short, I'm shocked and appalled a real, public corporation like Arkansas Best is operating what appears for all the world to be a scam, and refuses to make it right. Good chance a judge will be sorting this out.

MusicMom
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Re: ABF: movebuilder.com?

Postby MusicMom » Mon Feb 15, 2010 10:39 pm

It's not a scam. It's a messy situation and I'm bery sorry that the two of you had it happen to you, but it's not a scam.

NYCMover
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Re: ABF: movebuilder.com?

Postby NYCMover » Tue Feb 16, 2010 2:04 am

If ABF is offering packing/loading/transportation/unloading/unpacking services for customers moving Household goods - why are they not held accountable to the same standards as the major van lines or any other interstate mover? Because they predominantly run freight?

So, I guess any freight company that finds itself short of tonnage can jump into the moving industry arena with little or no local, state or federal government oversight and without following the same rules we do.

Let 'em come join the party. They've been hauling freight all of these years and haven't had to deal with the myriad of customer/logistical problems that any mover deals with on a day-by-day basis.

Welcome to my world, ABF. Keep it up and pretty soon your profit margins will be as thin as the rest of us.

:roll:

Rick
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Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2005 7:59 pm

Re: ABF: movebuilder.com?

Postby Rick » Tue Feb 16, 2010 7:41 am

Removed
Last edited by Rick on Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

ArchieWhite
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Re: ABF: movebuilder.com?

Postby ArchieWhite » Tue Feb 16, 2010 9:56 am

NYCMover wrote:If ABF is offering packing/loading/transportation/unloading/unpacking services for customers moving Household goods - why are they not held accountable to the same standards as the major van lines or any other interstate mover? Because they predominantly run freight?

So, I guess any freight company that finds itself short of tonnage can jump into the moving industry arena with little or no local, state or federal government oversight and without following the same rules we do.

Let 'em come join the party. They've been hauling freight all of these years and haven't had to deal with the myriad of customer/logistical problems that any mover deals with on a day-by-day basis.

Welcome to my world, ABF. Keep it up and pretty soon your profit margins will be as thin as the rest of us.

:roll:


Profit margins thin? I wish.....I look forward to getting back to what we did in the good old days... break even ( and work 60 hours a week to do it)

JMillerFL
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Location: Orlando

Re: ABF: movebuilder.com?

Postby JMillerFL » Tue Feb 16, 2010 7:16 pm

I do sales for one of the larger freight carriers and I avoid moving hhg like the plague. Having seen how movers do it and how the freight industry handles shipments there is no reason anyone in there right mind would ship their hhg on a spring loaded freight trailer. I know the air ride trialers have not always been around but when you take the avg person or a mover with limited experience in loading you are asking for damages. I believe this is why this market has not grown to other ltl freight carriers in a large scale. We have enough issues dealing with claims on poorly packed freight do you think we want to argue with a customer who incorrectly loaded their goods and wants to try and claim shipping damages?

blue92
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Joined: Wed Feb 10, 2010 12:35 pm

Re: ABF: movebuilder.com?

Postby blue92 » Thu Feb 18, 2010 7:31 am

The POVs here are fascinating and appreciated.

I have to admit that the phrase "freight industry" tends to remind me of the film Dogville a bit too much, but I understand where you guys are coming from. (There was a moving scam if there ever was one.)

I guess maybe if ABF can establish a history of reliability as a full-service broker, they might make it work, but for my own upcoming move I've chosen not to be one of the guinea pigs.

ArchieWhite
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Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2004 11:38 am

Re: ABF: movebuilder.com?

Postby ArchieWhite » Thu Mar 11, 2010 10:25 am

If ABF aligns with labor, doesn't that make them a full service mover, subject to the same rules and consumer regs as the rest of us slugs?

Don't they then have to give in home estimates, and pay claims the labor they align with might cause?

Good to see you Diane, you've been missed.

Diane
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Re: ABF: movebuilder.com?

Postby Diane » Thu Mar 11, 2010 10:28 am

Likewise, Archie. I hope that "Shakybarnes" will update us on what happens with his girlfriend's situation, because this seems like a very serious complaint even though it's obviously not a scam on the part of ABF.

Shakybarnes
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Feb 15, 2010 9:01 pm

Re: ABF: movebuilder.com?

Postby Shakybarnes » Sat Mar 27, 2010 2:10 pm

Hi. Here's an update. Keep in mind there are two primary service providers here -- almost a confusing set of players: Arkansas Best Corp. did the transport, as initially set up by its MoveBuilder operation and hauled by its ABF truck. But MoveBuilder contracted out the arrangements to MovingStaffers (aka Albert Container Concepts) of Texas, which handled the paperwork, took the money, and supplied local contract personnel to pack, load, and unload.

As an aside, here's there corporate hierarchies involved:
Arkansas Best Corp.
- Moving Solutions Inc. > Movebuilder.com
- ABF Trucking

Albert Container Concepts (Affiliated with Arkansas Best or separate???)
- MovingStaffers.com


So MovingStaffers is most directly responsible to the customer and is taking the claim. And when my girlfriend complained to Arkansas Best, they denied all responsibility and said our beef was with MovingStaffers.

So my girlfriend submitted a claim for several thousand dollars to Moving Staffers. She has a good deal of nice furniture, and the move literally damaged almost everything to some degree or another, with quite a few things simply gone missing.

MovingStaffers responded with a check for a small amount of money (well below $500). GF called them up, got in touch with apparently the top dude, who was a complete A-hole in telling her that that's all she'd get and good luck trying to sue.

That's it for now (case is still pending, as they say).

Still unclear is whether Arkansas Best actually owns MovingStaffers and uses this apparent separation to deny responsibility. Interestingly, though Moving Staffers (Albert Container) is based in Wichita Falls TX, the check they sent my GF was drawn on a bank in Fort Smith, Arkansas -- yes the hometown of Arkansas Best. Now that doesn't make a lot of sense.

Also, I know for a direct fact that when you use a bank card to pay MovingStaffers, your bank statement says the payment is debited to Moving Solutions, Inc -- the Arkansas Best subsidiary that operates Movebuilder.com. Now that's interesting.

Finally, the main customer contact at MovingStaffers is apt to use as contact info in her emails either MovingStaffers in Texas, or MoveBuilder in Arkansas, depending on the context. Again, sort of strange for two separate companies.

Needless to say I heartily warn anyone against ever using any of these names in moving -- MoveBuilder, MovingStaffers, ABF, Arkansas Best Corp., Moving Solutions Inc., Albert Container Concepts. I'm pushing my GF to file BBB complaints against any and all entities, though not sure if she's got round to that yet, or what she and her lawyer are going to do.

Jim
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Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2006 6:42 pm
Location: Sunny Southern California

Re: ABF: movebuilder.com?

Postby Jim » Sat Mar 27, 2010 2:44 pm

I'm pushing my GF to file BBB complaints against any and all entities, though not sure if she's got round to that yet, or what she and her lawyer are going to do.


I would definitely file the BBB reports, and a lawyer may be able to force Movingstaffers into a settlement for a little bit more just for you to go away. But there is a lesson here about ABF. Even if it could be proved the packers did the highest quality work imaginable, your items would ride in a spring-ride trailer. It means your stuff is going to bounce and bounce. If you have high-quality items to move, and you can't move it yourself, find a full-service mover and pay the money.

Insofar as to ithe entity's authority to operate as NYC pointed out, it depends on how the entities are established. If ABF Corp did this correctly, it's possible nobody owns an particular share of the other, but they are all related-parties to the other. If they do own a portion of each, it would be insufficient ownership to consider them as a subsidiary of the other. As such, they are independent, but related. As related parties, they don't necessarily need to possess the HHG authority. ABF is still a frieght carrier and they treat the HHG's as freight. One related party books the move and another related party packs the move. The lawyer would sue all 3, one would be determined as liable, and settle.
It's Sunny Somewhere In The World

Shakybarnes
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Feb 15, 2010 9:01 pm

Re: ABF: movebuilder.com?

Postby Shakybarnes » Sat Mar 27, 2010 6:03 pm

Jim, though I actually don't know anything about truck-suspension technologies, which apparently is a useful thing to be acquainted with, I have already been telling people that I've learned this lesson -- hire a REAL mover and don't use ABF.

Not sure who she'll wind up suing, but I guess what I find most objectionable in all this is that ABF markets this moving service, then doesn't even bother to PRETEND to care when their service and the contractors they hire destroy your property. I mean jeez they could at least have have put on an act and said the right things about wanting to ensure their customers have a good experience, or show some interest in what's happening under their brand name.

... they didn't even bother doing that much! ABF's immediate and only response is "not our fault, not our problem, go bother somebody else."

cltack
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Re: ABF: movebuilder.com?

Postby cltack » Mon Mar 29, 2010 3:57 pm

Does this mean definitely do NOT go with ABF movers? We finally made a decision to book with this company with Moving Staffers packing and loading a few large fragile items(2 men/3 hours) I think I may need to cancel.
Any opinions?


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